The Emasculation of 3rd Edition

[Halaster Blackcloak]

They should just let the PCs all be greater gods and skip right over the steps in between that and 4E.

[Zherbus]

The 4e QuickStart Rules are out. Here is the ammo to blast 4e. Arm yourselves!

All classes now have 'at-will' abilities, or abilities than can use any time (or 'at-will').

Sleep and Magic Missile are both in that category for magic-users now (though MM needs a successful 'to-hit' roll now).

Clerics have a chance to heal near-by allies if he scores a successful hit on a foe.

Fighters have an at-will power that gives him a +6 and, if successful in his attack, a near-by foe will take three points of damage (that means he has a permanent +6 to hit. Always.)

Thieves (Rogues) have an ability that forces attackers to re-roll ANY hit. So, if a rogue is hit during a fight, the attacker has to re-roll if he hits the rogue. Every. Attack.)

And every class has encounter abilities (usable once per encounter) and daily abilities (used, obviously, one per day). These powers are better than their at-will abilities.

Healing mid combat is possible without a cleric. "Second Wind" they call it.

Personally there are things in the new system that I can't stand.
1. Charge is now just a normal move where you must move at least 2 squares and to ANY open spot to get a +1 to hit.
2. Running is now only 2 extra squares of movement and you give an enemy a +2 to hit you for that round.
3.Healing is at a thing that ALL characters can do each encounter and then as much as they have left after words until used up for the day.
4. Death is harder and easier. All you need to do is fail 3 saves during the time you are 0 or below and you are dead (at heroic level) or you take damage equal to half your health below 0.
5. Daily rest is AMAZING thing. You heal ALL lost HP for the day. Lets say you have 50 hp and you are down to -20 when some one does a heal check and you no loger are in danger of dying but you are still at -20hp. if you rest for 6 hours you heal back to FULL!
6. If you are in negatives with hp, no matter how far, and you are healed you heal to 1 hp. No matter how far down you are…-1 or -20 you heal to 0.

magic in among the red blood cells

I have to check on that one...

Or, in a word: just plain bad.

[jeffx]

Magic Missle is an At-will but Sleep is not. Sleep is under the category of Level 1 Daily Spells (according to the PHB anyway). Second wind, is one of the things I have read so far that I can't stand.

Can't comment on any of the other stuff yet.

The 4e QuickStart Rules are out. Here is the ammo to blast 4e. Arm yourselves!

All classes now have 'at-will' abilities, or abilities than can use any time (or 'at-will').

Sleep and Magic Missile are both in that category for magic-users now (though MM needs a successful 'to-hit' roll now).

Clerics have a chance to heal near-by allies if he scores a successful hit on a foe.

Fighters have an at-will power that gives him a +6 and, if successful in his attack, a near-by foe will take three points of damage (that means he has a permanent +6 to hit. Always.)

Thieves (Rogues) have an ability that forces attackers to re-roll ANY hit. So, if a rogue is hit during a fight, the attacker has to re-roll if he hits the rogue. Every. Attack.)

And every class has encounter abilities (usable once per encounter) and daily abilities (used, obviously, one per day). These powers are better than their at-will abilities.

Healing mid combat is possible without a cleric. "Second Wind" they call it.

Personally there are things in the new system that I can't stand.
1. Charge is now just a normal move where you must move at least 2 squares and to ANY open spot to get a +1 to hit.
2. Running is now only 2 extra squares of movement and you give an enemy a +2 to hit you for that round.
3.Healing is at a thing that ALL characters can do each encounter and then as much as they have left after words until used up for the day.
4. Death is harder and easier. All you need to do is fail 3 saves during the time you are 0 or below and you are dead (at heroic level) or you take damage equal to half your health below 0.
5. Daily rest is AMAZING thing. You heal ALL lost HP for the day. Lets say you have 50 hp and you are down to -20 when some one does a heal check and you no loger are in danger of dying but you are still at -20hp. if you rest for 6 hours you heal back to FULL!
6. If you are in negatives with hp, no matter how far, and you are healed you heal to 1 hp. No matter how far down you are…-1 or -20 you heal to 0.

magic in among the red blood cells

I have to check on that one...

Or, in a word: just plain bad.

[Halaster Blackcloak]

Zherbus posted:

5. Daily rest is AMAZING thing. You heal ALL lost HP for the day. Lets say you have 50 hp and you are down to -20 when some one does a heal check and you no loger are in danger of dying but you are still at -20hp. if you rest for 6 hours you heal back to FULL!

Well that cuts it. The people at WOTC have lost their minds. This isn't a roleplaying game anymore. It's a freaking emasculated video game in paper format! That is by far the stupidest post-AD&D rule I have ever heard.

That clinches it. I have no doubt whatsoever. 4E is just a more emasculated, player-coddling, piece of shit game system that is totally and utterly unrelated to the game called Dungeons & Dragons. I don't care what legal rights they have to the name, this is nothing more than a gruesome rape of a classic game.

Looking at all those goofy changes, there is no way I can remain sane and claim otherwise.

[Zherbus]

If it makes 3.x look hardcore, it's got issues.

[Halaster Blackcloak]

LOL! That's saying something!

[maraudar]

Halaster wrote:

Well that cuts it. The people at WOTC have lost their minds. This isn't a roleplaying game anymore. It's a freaking emasculated video game in paper format!

And that pretty much sums todays gaming environment. At least as far as fantasy settings go. Swing a sword twice as big as you are and have no effects because Jodo the halfling want to of course. Leap tall buildings and walls if you don't want to knock them down, because at 1st level you are a freakin god!... Death? What is this death you speak of? We simply lay down for a while until our spirit returns from the graveyard... Ugh...

I pretty much have left the fantasy setting for others the last couple of years. I play in a lot of pulp and survival horror games predominately now. Some of it is over the top but that is the nature of the genre.


It seems that video rpg's (WoW, Everquest etc) have become the bar by which all rpg's are set against. Sad part is that while these games are by definition an rpg they have lost all th elements that made role playing so enjoyable.

Now it is mainly about what powers, spells and gear you have that defines the conception of roleplaying. Are there exceptions? Yes but they are few and far between sadly enough.

Maraudar

[Zherbus]

It seems that video rpg's (WoW, Everquest etc) have become the bar by which all rpg's are set against. Sad part is that while these games are by definition an rpg they have lost all th elements that made role playing so enjoyable.

Sad, isn't it?

If RPG's come up in casual conversation with random people, they always gloat on some Final Fantasy clone or WoW. Ick.